Reporting Creation Theft
Just so I'm clear... I'm totally cool with putting my stuff out there, and people remixing my creations into new things, or improving or adding features to my work.
However, it seems there are people who--while meaning to or not--use my creations and publish them as their own. I've looked hard for what they've done in their creation that is different to the original, but cannot see anything at all. I've looked in the description, but these tend to be empty. And I've left comments asking what they changed from the original, or what they added, and they do not respond.
Without any way of knowing why this "new" creation exists outside of simply using my original work, it just amounts to theft of the work. (I'm not talking criminally or legally here, but this is a friendly community, and sharing is encouraged. So it's more about the etiquette and politeness than charging them with criminal damages or anything.)
Some such creations are remixes, though no actual "remixing" is evident--though my name is on the cover page. Some create a new creation, add my work to it, and then publish it--which doesn't carry my name on the cover page but only in the "full credits."
I am aware there is a report button, but there is no suitable option for the kind of report I wish to make. The list is extensive, but are more general to good human behaviour online. It doesn't have any more specific report types for a community built on creating and sharing their work and being properly credited for it.
Should I be using one of the existing types in the report menu? Should I be reporting this using some other method? What is the correct process people in the community should use for this kind of grievance? (A word from Mm would be much appreciated on this, if possible. Thanks in advance.)
I've reported this again in the feedback section, in the hopes someone sees it. Bad form, in my view, but I feel like it's pretty important to resolve sooner than later. https://feedback.indreams.me/forums/917383-dreams-feedback/suggestions/39820015-there-needs-to-be-a-way-to-report-bad-faith-creati
This is become a huge problem now. Ever since YouTube's biggest creator, PewDiePie, made a video asking for people to create Dreams for him to play, the creation theft has skyrocketed.
There are even several examples of people...
1. Remixing a great, original creation
2. Releasing it with NO or VERY FEW changes
3. Putting that stolen creation in a Dream
4. Releasing the Dream with the stolen creation in it
5. Don't credit the original creator anywhere
Yes, you can eventually find the original creation if you dig hard enough through the credits/comments/genealogy, but 99% of people never look at that stuff.
Some even go as far as to create multiple accounts to give a like on their own stolen Dream. Then, spam countless useless comments so you have to scroll a long time to reach the comments calling out the creation theft.
The problem, imo, lies in the fact that...
1. You can release "remixed" creations without changing a single thing
2. There isn't a single indicator on a Dream's overview page that shows it contains remixed creations or anything
3. We can't report comment spamming and/or creation-stealing Dreamers
If MediaMolecule doesn't act soon, this problem will only get bigger and bigger, and it will hurt the community in multiple ways
- More and more people restricting remixability of their creations because of this problem
- People getting disencouraged to be original, since plainly copying other people's stuff isn't acted upon and rakes in the likes
- Original creations getting less likes and attention compared to the stolen version, this is already happening, and the original creator can't do anything
Personally, I don't really care for how many followers I have, but some people do. And if I look around I see several creation-stealing dreamers with a decent following. All those followers are probably clueless of the fact that this Dreamer does nothing more than steal. I wouldn't blame other follower-hungry Dreamers to start copying other peoples stuff since it apparently works wonders for gaining a following...
Lol. Somebody has a ME complex. Yiy feel the absolute need to be recognized and validated as your objects creator. Wow. Talk about narcissistic. Do you want your name is 50 point font and neon and blinking on the cover page? Get a life kid.
(This is Supposer.)
@mypetcarcass: True. However...
If Dreams ends up being full of clones of other people's work, that makes for an unhealthy community, with little new being made or found, and people ripping other people off for the sole purpose of getting likes.
When I read posts like this it's obvious that people don't understand the purpose of Dreams. You don't own anything. You don't own rights to anything. You can't make money off of this. The game is about making whatever you want and be able to use any content made by anyone. Kind of like a hippie community. If that's a problem then don't create your ideas and games in a open-source environment. Kind of a no-brainer
I think perhaps you may have remixed the zombie as its own thing, and then imported that into your scene. That would require the zombie creation to be published when you publish the scene. That would be my guess, anyway.
I think perhaps what was happening with my creations was that people were saving remixes so they could easily update it in their scenes or something? I understand why that would be useful. But it is strange they didn't change the name or write something about this somewhere... or even respond to my comments.
@Supposer not sure if you'll read this but let me tell you my personal experience. During the beta I was testing out some stuff, and imported a Zombie model into my scene. To suit my needs, I made some tiny change to the puppet - like change animation sliders for example. Then, when I went to publish the level, the game told me I had do publish the "new" zombie asset as a "Remix of Zombie" as a separate element. So I was kinda forced to put out there this remix version.
Since then lots of people have used my Remix of Zombie version. I feel kinda embarassed by it, because I didn't really know what I was doing....it's a very poor job over the original one, and I wondered if I was doing something wrong. Ultimately, I believe the original creator is getting credited, as is stated by Media Molecule.
So you see, maybe people have no intention of "stealing" anything, but the way Dreams work, it makes you republish stuff for any tiny detail you change in your scene.
Curiously....I've used many shared assets I my creations since then and this rule doesn't apply to most objects....but this zombie in particular....it always asks me to republish it somehow. I don't understand it.
I thought you click full credits and it shows who was in the whole creation?
Someone remixed my creation but it doesn’t show my name it shows like 5 others and my name they should have it to wear Publishers name automatically shows on middle of creations
The best way to get around this is to make the remixable version of your scene the one with the least amount of final logic. I don't mind people using my set pieces, environments and characters so long as they build their own story with them. I see no value in allowing them to remix my final game because those are all my ideas played out exactly how I wanted them to. The only reason I would make a final scene or game remixable with all the logic included is if I'm offering it as a tutorial, or if I'm passing it off to another creator for help with a certain section.
@CLOUD: As I explained at the start of my post, I am all for that. This is why I made those creations: that people could use them in their scenes, or remix them to be more their style or to better fit their needs. Seeing that kind of thing is great! It's awesome to get notifications when people use my work in various ways. And it's a pleasure to go see how they've used it.
As I also explained in my post, that is not what I'm talking about. It's pretty easy to make remix something someone else made, and publish it to make it look like--from the cover page at least--you took another creation and changed it for the better, or even that you created it entirely yourself. This is disingenuous, and something akin to false advertising--hence drawing the link to a "theft" of sorts.
This thread is aimed at finding out how Mm would like me to report such behaviour, as it's certainly not in harmony with the spirit of sharing and creating together that Mm is trying to instill in Dreams (and that they succeed in doing across 99% of the dreamiverse).
@Denjo: It's worth noting that you *cannot* publish an element (a thing that goes into a scene as opposed to a scene or dream) *without* it being remixable.
That said, I did want it to be remixable. This allows people to add it to their own creations, and to make changes to it to improve it or style it how they need to for their own uses. That's why I made it in the first place; to let people use it and change it how they see fit.
However, the examples mentioned in the post did not add it to their own creation. They didn't change it to be their own style or something.
They saw my creation, remixed it, saved it, and published it with no changes whatsoever--as if they'd just slapped a sticker with their name on it next to mine without being involved in any way in making that version. At least in that instance, their "version" is marked as a remix of mine, and so has my name on the front cover. Though they could get around that easily by remixing their own version and re-publishing it, at which point my name is further buried into the genealogy or full credits.
The worse case was where someone made a new blank creation, imported by creation, saved it, and published it. This is *not* marked as a remix, and so does *not* have my name on the cover.
If there's only one name on the cover (using either method) people aren't going to think, "I wonder who made this? Let me check the credits and genealogy." They're going to think "that guy with his name on the cover made it." If they *do* check the full credits, they'll see my name in there and think, "oh, that's nice. They made a thing, and he helped."
And if people start using these no-effort shell-creations instead of the original that is literally exactly the same, the name of the person who made that shell-creation will be included in the full credits as people who helped make those other things also. In what way did they help? What are they getting credit *for*?
Something to note, though, is the topic of this thread. I'm not trying to post feedback about the crediting system; it's a tough nut to crack, and will take time to get right. That's what EA is for, after all. I recognise that for now, it's pretty easy to file the creator's name off of the cover page and post something as if you had made it yourself. For the foreseeable future, there's no way to prevent that from happening; it's going to happen.
So the topic of this thread is, what to do about it. I feel this kind of "theft" or whatever you want to call it wouldn't be good for the community if it becomes widespread--or even if it's more low level in the background. It seems to me that pretending to have made something when you had no part in it isn't in the spirit of creating and sharing that Mm wants for Dreams. Right now, there may be no way of preventing this from happening. But there is a way of reporting creations for various reasons already in place. So if we could use that to bring these "stolen" creations to Mm's attention, they could decide what (if anything) should happen about it.
@Adarwell: It's only remixable stuff. Though it's worth noting that you cannot release an element without it being remixable. The "remixable" status is what allows people to add those creations into their scenes, so that's fair enough. But it does allow people to simply repost something with no changes or effort.
So for your scenes containing lost of elements... people could go to that creation, remix it, save it making no changes whatsoever, and release it. Or they could create a new bank creation, import your creation, save it with no changes whatsoever, and release that--which currently means it would not even be marked as a remix or have your name anywhere on the cover page.
As I explained, it's unclear if the people who did this had malicious intent, or if they didn't know that would hide the name, or if they just republished it by accident or something.
Making something online public and remixable essentially grants permission to anyone in the dreamiverse to use your creation.
This means they may freely use your creation as is, or modify it however they please.
The original creation will always remain linked to you and you should see your name in the full credits section and the geneology section if I'm not mistaken.
To be fair, it's kinda your fault. If you publish something to be remixable, some people might abuse that.
Since you are credited for that creation I don't see the problem here or something worth reporting. You should definitely think twice about what you want to share as remixable now and see it positive, no his remix acts as an advertisement for your stuff.
Just curious - are they stealing the remixable stuff? Or even dreams released as non remixable can be copied and released?
So far when I wanted to give people way to remix my stuff, I prepared separated scene (will all items + description,...) but did not let them copy the original. So if they want to remix, they can, but they have to remix it into something usefull.